Outgoing Portal

[leo from jersey]

I think the biggest disappointment would be Sage. Two years to develop, knows the system and assuming the info is accurate there are going to be 10-15 minutes per game open to give Aziz a rest. He's on the track we've had many big men follow in the past, two bench years to develop, one year as a backup and then two years as a quality starter.

If he's leaving, it's almost certainly because he's being told he's not good enough at the Big 12 level, not because he has better options. Which means the coaches either failed to assess him accurately as a recruit or failed to develop him. Combine that with not seeing much growth on offense from our other front court players this year and it seems like we need to target an assistant who makes that his forte (maybe Mike Roberts wants to come back).

We'd also have to find a young big man (or two) good enough to backup Aziz, but who is also willing not to play starter minutes this year. Which is not an easy prospect.

Lots of pressure was put on a new coach to sign the tall local kid. Lot of pressure on the 4th year coach if Sage is pushed out, That pressure will come from the local HS coaches in recruiting. Not a good situation. More to this than ability to play at the Big 12 level, but I have a feeling Zykarious knows this. This is a hard call.

[leo from jersey]

Not to throw fear out there, but until May comes around you never know who else will go. Teams can tamper and players can put out highest bidder/more playing time filers. Heck UC may see more productive players and push more than 3 out the door. Thus, UC has to throw more money at the keepers. Zykarious has been very observant.

[sedz]

I think the biggest disappointment would be Sage. Two years to develop, knows the system and assuming the info is accurate there are going to be 10-15 minutes per game open to give Aziz a rest. He's on the track we've had many big men follow in the past, two bench years to develop, one year as a backup and then two years as a quality starter.

If he's leaving, it's almost certainly because he's being told he's not good enough at the Big 12 level, not because he has better options. Which means the coaches either failed to assess him accurately as a recruit or failed to develop him. Combine that with not seeing much growth on offense from our other front court players this year and it seems like we need to target an assistant who makes that his forte (maybe Mike Roberts wants to come back).

We'd also have to find a young big man (or two) good enough to backup Aziz, but who is also willing not to play starter minutes this year. Which is not an easy prospect.

I think we already have several guys who can be serviceable at the 5, even if they don't have traditional size, rim protection, or post scoring. It's useful to have a couple big bodies when needed, but I don't want to reload with slow bigs.

My wishlist is wings, wings, and more wings.

[cpawstoney]

Well that sounds very ominous! Going to be honest with you all, after following bearcat bball for over fifty years, a lot of the joy came from watching young men develope into adults and develope, adapt, and ultimately acclimate themselves into the coaches system, gelling into a unit. I have no inside information but this wholesale transferring at the end of each season with all programs,and having to get to "know" new players every year is making it harder for someone of my age to invest time into trying to be a fan.

Exactly! The fun and joy of the program was watching players like Kenyon Martin, Danny Fortson, Steve Logan, Jason Maxiell and others come into the system and get better each year. NIL is killing that. That's why I never liked programs like Kentucky with their one and dones.

[Rufus]

Agreed ,with this, albeit with a little less experience as a fan. One of the real joys of being a UC fan (in particular) has been the opportunity to watch the "under the radar" players develop over time into stars (think Levertis Robinson under Yates, Ryan Fltecher, Bobby Brannen, and even Kenyon under Huggins, Trevon Scott and Justin Jackson for Cronin as examples) over the course of 3 or 4 years, or underrecruited "glue guys" becoming instrumental (Tarrance Gibson, Jaquan Parker, Rashad Bishop (I know T Rat was a juco player, but still one of my all-time favorites for doing all the little things and after seeing several instances of true kindness from him in the community when I was still in high school). It's always been something that I felt like we have "better" than fans for UK and other "blue bloods", where you don't develop a real relationship with the one-and-dones (which is why I don't have the same level of connection to Lance, Dontoniio, Kenny Satterfield, or DerMarr-great (albeit the first two frustrated me to no end while they were here) players, but didn't get to see them develop and grow here, so don't feel as tied to them. That's all being lost now. I think I am actually sadder to see the loss of the valuable "role players" leaving to chase "stardom" that will likely never come. The reality is that many of us (in life as in sports) are better suited as "glue guys", who are the backbone and throughline of any successful organization. The ability to learn that about yourself, to commit to a system where over time you can learn how best to develop your individual skills to support the whole, and to become part of a successful team (including things that are "different from how I would do it" is incredibly valuable not just for your time as an athlete but for the rest of your existence, and I feel like that is truly lost with the unlimited transfers. To be clear, I don't think the "old way" was fair either (where coaches have unlimited free agency, but players are trapped when their coaching staff leaves them)-but there should be some way to find a happy (er) medium.

One of my all time favorite Bearcats, not because of his offensive skills or his defense for it was not exact either was Justin Jackson. He came in as a spindly kid but for the years he played for Cronin he gave 150% while on the court. He would literally run through a wall if Cronin ask him to. He eventually developed into a serviceable ball player, but gave it his all every minute he was on the court.

[zykarious]

Three guys who struggled to find playing time. I never like to see guys choose to leave, but it's clear they weren't going to be key pieces moving forward.

I think the biggest disappointment would be Sage. Two years to develop, knows the system and assuming the info is accurate there are going to be 10-15 minutes per game open to give Aziz a rest. He's on the track we've had many big men follow in the past, two bench years to develop, one year as a backup and then two years as a quality starter.

If he's leaving, it's almost certainly because he's being told he's not good enough at the Big 12 level, not because he has better options. Which means the coaches either failed to assess him accurately as a recruit or failed to develop him. Combine that with not seeing much growth on offense from our other front court players this year and it seems like we need to target an assistant who makes that his forte (maybe Mike Roberts wants to come back).

We'd also have to find a young big man (or two) good enough to backup Aziz, but who is also willing not to play starter minutes this year. Which is not an easy prospect.

[zykarious]

Very good point. Very seldom do you hear anyone talk about graduation rates. Sometimes there is talk concerning an individual player graduating early or an older player being in graduate school, but very seldom, if ever, do you hear of program graduation rates. Also, when a student (non-athlete) transfers from one school to another, there typically is a loss in academic credits because not all academic credits transfer.

Has the NCAA reached a level of indifference where the academics have become secondary to the athletics and the income that the athletics can generate? Only a very small percentage of these college athletes will go pro. So, it is extremely important for these players to get a good solid education. For the players that do not have professional level talent, or go into coaching, they will go on to graduate (I guess), get married, and start families. Their educations will come in handy when playing the LIFE GAME. I truly hope that the NCAA does NOT lose focus of why most of these STUDENTS are in college in the first place; to get an education.

I agree in that I love seeing guys stick around and develop. We had it great in that aspect with Cronin, he has one of the lowest transfer rates in the NCAA throughout his career. Now with the new rules and Wes being closer to middle of the pack in retention rates, year over year turnover is becoming the norm. At least we are in the Big 12 and have a reasonable amount of NIL money, so we don't have to worry as much about losing up and coming players. If we were still in the AAC, our top players would be huge targets for other teams (and they could still get poached even at our current level).

I'd argue that athletes are more than making up for whatever they are losing out on in education. A nice chunk of NIL money to get them started after college doesn't hurt either. Let's face it, the value in college is mostly not in "education" it's in getting the piece of paper that shows you were willing to stick with it. Learning the hard work, dedication and effort required of D1 athletes is more value in the long term than missing out on some high quality classes. Businesses value that (and name recognition too), as college athletes are employed at quite a bit higher rates than college graduates.

That said, I do hope something changes down the line. It's hard to imagine without a complete remodeling (or likely a breakaway from the NCAA). Contracts, salary caps and so forth. Make it official that colleges really are a minor league system for pro-leagues. That could even come with an adjustment to the 4-year eligibility rule. Hard to say exactly what it will look like or when it will arrive, but it seems like it's coming eventually.

If Lobot's info is accurate, we are already expecting a minimum of three transfers and that's only if no one leaves later in transfer season. If we have someone get poached like MAW last year or someone leave after new guys arrive over playing time concerns we could easily get to 4/5 and turning over over half the team again once you count Newman and Ody running out of eligibility.

[leeraymond]

I'm with you. Free agency in pro sports is bad enought. It really sucks for college. Isn't it funny that it used to be a thing that players would go on academic probation. Now it's not even mentioned. I find it hard to believe that all these players switching schools each year could be doing well academically. There can't be any continuity to their studies. It's as if being in college to get an education isn't even a factor.

Very good point. Very seldom do you hear anyone talk about graduation rates. Sometimes there is talk concerning an individual player graduating early or an older player being in graduate school, but very seldom, if ever, do you hear of program graduation rates. Also, when a student (non-athlete) transfers from one school to another, there typically is a loss in academic credits because not all academic credits transfer.

Has the NCAA reached a level of indifference where the academics have become secondary to the athletics and the income that the athletics can generate? Only a very small percentage of these college athletes will go pro. So, it is extremely important for these players to get a good solid education. For the players that do not have professional level talent, or go into coaching, they will go on to graduate (I guess), get married, and start families. Their educations will come in handy when playing the LIFE GAME. I truly hope that the NCAA does NOT lose focus of why most of these STUDENTS are in college in the first place; to get an education.

[sedz]

Three guys who struggled to find playing time. I never like to see guys choose to leave, but it's clear they weren't going to be key pieces moving forward.

[Lobot]

Very intriguing Labot. Do you have any more hints that you CAN share at this time?

Nope but if you look around, someone nailed it in another thread.

[leeraymond]

It looks like, and nothing is in written in stone, that we will have 3 guys hitting the portal on Tuesday. All in the front court. The reason I'm not saying who is the same reason you don't ruin a commitment announcement for a kid. I'm going to let them make their own announcements on the subject. I'm not trying to tease you all. If it plays out the way I've been told, most of you will be not all that disappointed in the outcome.

Very intriguing Labot. Do you have any more hints that you CAN share at this time?

[Longtime Lurker]

Well that sounds very ominous! Going to be honest with you all, after following bearcat bball for over fifty years, a lot of the joy came from watching young men develope into adults and develope, adapt, and ultimately acclimate themselves into the coaches system, gelling into a unit. I have no inside information but this wholesale transferring at the end of each season with all programs,and having to get to "know" new players every year is making it harder for someone of my age to invest time into trying to be a fan.

Agreed ,with this, albeit with a little less experience as a fan. One of the real joys of being a UC fan (in particular) has been the opportunity to watch the "under the radar" players develop over time into stars (think Levertis Robinson under Yates, Ryan Fltecher, Bobby Brannen, and even Kenyon under Huggins, Trevon Scott and Justin Jackson for Cronin as examples) over the course of 3 or 4 years, or underrecruited "glue guys" becoming instrumental (Tarrance Gibson, Jaquan Parker, Rashad Bishop (I know T Rat was a juco player, but still one of my all-time favorites for doing all the little things and after seeing several instances of true kindness from him in the community when I was still in high school). It's always been something that I felt like we have "better" than fans for UK and other "blue bloods", where you don't develop a real relationship with the one-and-dones (which is why I don't have the same level of connection to Lance, Dontoniio, Kenny Satterfield, or DerMarr-great (albeit the first two frustrated me to no end while they were here) players, but didn't get to see them develop and grow here, so don't feel as tied to them. That's all being lost now. I think I am actually sadder to see the loss of the valuable "role players" leaving to chase "stardom" that will likely never come. The reality is that many of us (in life as in sports) are better suited as "glue guys", who are the backbone and throughline of any successful organization. The ability to learn that about yourself, to commit to a system where over time you can learn how best to develop your individual skills to support the whole, and to become part of a successful team (including things that are "different from how I would do it" is incredibly valuable not just for your time as an athlete but for the rest of your existence, and I feel like that is truly lost with the unlimited transfers. To be clear, I don't think the "old way" was fair either (where coaches have unlimited free agency, but players are trapped when their coaching staff leaves them)-but there should be some way to find a happy (er) medium.

[Lobot]

It looks like, and nothing is in written in stone, that we will have 3 guys hitting the portal on Tuesday. All in the front court. The reason I'm not saying who is the same reason you don't ruin a commitment announcement for a kid. I'm going to let them make their own announcements on the subject. I'm not trying to tease you all. If it plays out the way I've been told, most of you will be not all that disappointed in the outcome.

[Lobot]

Is it wrong to read into the fact that Jizzle's father was never seen in Bearcats gear as a sign that his dad is pushing Jizzle to look elsewhere?

You are wrong to think so.

[Gmann]

Well that sounds very ominous! Going to be honest with you all, after following bearcat bball for over fifty years, a lot of the joy came from watching young men develope into adults and develope, adapt, and ultimately acclimate themselves into the coaches system, gelling into a unit. I have no inside information but this wholesale transferring at the end of each season with all programs,and having to get to "know" new players every year is making it harder for someone of my age to invest time into trying to be a fan.

I'm with you. Free agency in pro sports is bad enought. It really sucks for college. Isn't it funny that it used to be a thing that players would go on academic probation. Now it's not even mentioned. I find it hard to believe that all these players switching schools each year could be doing well academically. There can't be any continuity to their studies. It's as if being in college to get an education isn't even a factor.