Sad State of Bearcat Basketball

[leeraymond372@gmail.com]

The one thing that bothers me about UC basketball is not the current win-loss record, but with all of the pro-prospects (Miller, Thiam, and Abaev), the high-school All-American (Abaev), the NBA coaching consultants, staff, and directors, UC is one of the bottom teams in the BIG XII. UC has a bunch of players that have been a part of high-major basketball for a long time. UC's two main guards are 3-year BIG XII guards and it has a coaching staff that has over 20 years of collective college basketball experience. Wow! It seems unbelievable that they cannot do better than what have been doing.

Zero (0) wins against Power 4 and Big East teams this year (0-4). What makes us think it will get better in the BIG XII?

Under Miller, the program desperately lacks the KILLER INSTINCT to win. That killer instinct is something that Huggins and Cronin had.

[Gmann]

The one thing that bothers me about UC basketball is not the current win-loss record, but with all of the pro-prospects (Miller, Thiam, and Abaev), the high-school All-American (Abaev), the NBA coaching consultants, staff, and directors, UC is one of the bottom teams in the BIG XII. UC has a bunch of players that have been a part of high-major basketball for a long time. UC's two main guards are 3-year BIG XII guards and it has a coaching staff that has over 20 years of collective college basketball experience. Wow! It seems unbelievable that they cannot do better than what have been doing.

Zero (0) wins against Power 4 and Big East teams this year (0-4). What makes us think it will get better in the BIG XII?

Under Miller, the program desperately lacks the KILLER INSTINCT to win. That killer instinct is something that Huggins and Cronin had.

All those reasons and more prove Miller is completely incapable of successfully coaching at this level! They need 14 or 15 wins in the conference to have a chance at the tourney and given the fact we have zero quad 1 or 2 wins make that goal unattainable. It's a shame that his current buyout will require us to suffer through the rest of season agony at least before consideration of another coach.

[leeraymond372@gmail.com]

Merry Christmas to everyone. Enjoy your families and friends. Best wishes for the New Year. Do not drink too much.

[bearcatbret]

Here are Net rankings for local teams:
UK - 26
tosu - 43
Miami - 79
Dayton - 90
UC - 108
x - 121
NKU - 216

I wonder where Butler and IU fits into this.

[swilsonsp4]

Here are Net rankings for local teams:
UK - 26
tosu - 43
Miami - 79
Dayton - 90
UC - 108
x - 121
NKU - 216

I wonder where Butler and IU fits into this.

IN - 32
Butler - 42

[Lobot]

In the spirit of this thread, let's do the 5 Ws

Why are we underachieving with this roster?

Who is responsible?

What is the solution?

Where is the money going?

(w)How are we going to fix it all?


If you come back with everything is Wes and John's fault, explain your opinion, if you haven't already previously.

[leo from jersey]

In the spirit of this thread, let's do the 5 Ws

Why are we underachieving with this roster?

Who is responsible?

What is the solution?

Where is the money going?

(w)How are we going to fix it all?


If you come back with everything is Wes and John's fault, explain your opinion, if you haven't already previously.

I will add the 6th w -- I wish I knew exactly and I wish there was a way to fix it.

[London 'Cat]

In the spirit of this thread, let's do the 5 Ws

Why are we underachieving with this roster?

Who is responsible?

What is the solution?

Where is the money going?

(w)How are we going to fix it all?


If you come back with everything is Wes and John's fault, explain your opinion, if you haven't already previously.

Is UC underachieving? I am not saying they are or are not. Maybe the players on the roster are not what the coaching staff thought or that the fans believed. Maybe it's a problem that sedz referred to in a prior thread - the players recruited are not effective players and their stats back that up.

The coaches are the bottom line. Whether they recruited the wrong players, whether they can't coach them properly, whether they are not establishing a winning culture, it all comes back to the coaching staff. You can blame it on the AD for making the wrong hire, but the AD also has little to no influence of the team's play. It fall squarely at the feet of the coaching staff.

The solution is to move on from CWM as he is not the coach UC thought it was hiring. He amassed a great number of wins at a young age, albeit in a lesser conference. Sometimes, a coach answers the call when stepping up the competition. In CWM's case, he did not dominate the lesser competition, and it appears UC fell for the fools gold. Whatever the case, CWM has not stepped up to the competition. I am asking because I do not know, but how many Q1 games has CWM won while at UC? I am thinking the number is between 0-5, which is terrible over the 4+ years he has been at UC.

Where the money is going is a mystery to me, because not one player seems to be worth the price UC is paying for them. We don't know the amount of NIL contracts but we have heard varied amounts. I can tell you that none of these players have earned their contracts to date, with the exception of Baba Miller, and even that is in question.

Like leo from jersey wrote, how we fix it is the $1M question. I think UC starts with replacing CWM and hiring a coach who will stand up to the big $ donors, telling them he will coach the team in his way regardless of their opinions. It is the only way a coach can be successful, otherwise the coach is simply a public face of the program.

[Lobot]

Whewwww , that last paragraph is gold. I'm thankful for our big donors and other boosters but yeah, they need to butt out regarding on court stuff. Money talks but if you're not an expert on the actual sport, maybe defer to those with actual expertise in that.

I don't fell like Wes or John are in full control of the program right now and that's translates to Football for John .

You'd think the big money folks would want better ROI than whatever this mess is right now.

I'll repeat my mantra. Fans cheer, players play, coaches coach, administrators administrate, donors donate. If everyone stays in their lane we'd bet better off than where we are now.

[sedz]

In the spirit of this thread, let's do the 5 Ws

Why are we underachieving with this roster?

Who is responsible?

What is the solution?

Where is the money going?

(w)How are we going to fix it all?


If you come back with everything is Wes and John's fault, explain your opinion, if you haven't already previously.

We're underachieving because we run an outdated inefficient offense and we don't prioritize analytics for roster construction. This roster wasn't great to begin with. We started the season #40 on Torvik, not exactly an NCAA lock.

Wes Miller is ultimately responsible for this season. The AD is responsible long term.

The solution is to hire people who use current tools and strategies. Until that happens we will be left behind.

I don't know where the money is going. The only guys worth paying on this roster are Jizzle, Day Day, Baba, and Thiam. I can understand taking a risk on Abaev. Everyone else was a sub 3 BPM player, and we can't afford to waste money on that. Are we paying good money to Kriisa, Harris, and Celestine? I hope not.

To fix it we have to play Moneyball. We aren't spending like top 20 teams. We have to get value for every dollar, and get the most out of what we land with efficient strategy. At least 4 BPM at every position. Modern strategies on both sides of the ball, and willing to implement new ones each year.

I don't think effort is the issue. I think college athletes generally play hard. There isn't a magic motivation button to be pressed. But we can get more production from the same effort and talent with better tactics. And we can better predict talent by using production based metrics.

[leo from jersey]

We're underachieving because we run an outdated inefficient offense and we don't prioritize analytics for roster construction. This roster wasn't great to begin with. We started the season #40 on Torvik, not exactly an NCAA lock.

Wes Miller is ultimately responsible for this season. The AD is responsible long term.

The solution is to hire people who use current tools and strategies. Until that happens we will be left behind.

I don't know where the money is going. The only guys worth paying on this roster are Jizzle, Day Day, Baba, and Thiam. I can understand taking a risk on Abaev. Everyone else was a sub 3 BPM player, and we can't afford to waste money on that. Are we paying good money to Kriisa, Harris, and Celestine? I hope not.

To fix it we have to play Moneyball. We aren't spending like top 20 teams. We have to get value for every dollar, and get the most out of what we land with efficient strategy. At least 4 BPM at every position. Modern strategies on both sides of the ball, and willing to implement new ones each year.

I don't think effort is the issue. I think college athletes generally play hard. There isn't a magic motivation button to be pressed. But we can get more production from the same effort and talent with better tactics. And we can better predict talent by using production based metrics.

good points but what about defense, ;lack of rebounding, solid passing, free throw shooting and hustling down the court on defense.

[sedz]

good points but what about defense, ;lack of rebounding, solid passing, free throw shooting and hustling down the court on defense.

There are metrics for rebounding rate, assist rate, turnover rate, free throw rate and conversion, and defensive BPM. We need to use those production metrics. I don't care of a player achieves it through hustle, size, skill, or sneaking things past the refs. I want players who produce, full stop.

[leo from jersey]

There are metrics for rebounding rate, assist rate, turnover rate, free throw rate and conversion, and defensive BPM. We need to use those production metrics. I don't care of a player achieves it through hustle, size, skill, or sneaking things past the refs. I want players who produce, full stop.

the thing is one has many variables when dealing with humans and not just x and or a play station platform. Not only different opponents, moods, health, etc. If your teammate is setting quality screens a shooter might hit more and if not, less. The same goes for help defense and rebounding help. It is still a team game. Where are the metrics for free throw shooting or inability to see and recognize the court. I want fundamentally trained, inspired, hustling, caring players and then there is no stopping. Metrics can give insights, but it is what inside a player that wins games. Over te last few decades, some have lost awareness of the human.

[leeraymond372@gmail.com]

the thing is one has many variables when dealing with humans and not just x and or a play station platform. Not only different opponents, moods, health, etc. If your teammate is setting quality screens a shooter might hit more and if not, less. The same goes for help defense and rebounding help. It is still a team game. Where are the metrics for free throw shooting or inability to see and recognize the court. I want fundamentally trained, inspired, hustling, caring players and then there is no stopping. Metrics can give insights, but it is what inside a player that wins games. Over te last few decades, some have lost awareness of the human.

You know Leo, when I read your post, I was thinking that you were talking about toughness and not letting a team out-work you. Huggins was a master at having teams that out-worked his opponents. This really showed late in the second half. Kelvin Sampson's Houston teams have that capability of wearing a team down by being tougher and out-working them. I understand what you are saying.

[bearcatlifer]

I agree with all of the above but one thing struck me: a metric for free throw shooting. That is about as easy a metric to understand as any. Why do we have such difficulty recruiting players who can both score high in other metrics and shoot free throws? Most other teams seem to have figured this out.If you retrospectively projected an 80% free throw percentage over the current season's played games we could easily have won 3-4 more games.No it's not sexy or cool and it doesn't show up on highlight reels. You can't thump your chest or hold up one finger when you sink a free throw. You can't taunt your opponent when you make one.Maybe that's why our players don't take it seriously.Yet Wes just lets the inmates run the asylum.