Look for Division 4 to revolutionize college athletics

[bearcattom]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoot...lege-athletics

"Get ready for an expansion of that purgatory for the have-nots. The message was as clear as the division between the BCS and non-BCS conferences. ACC commissioner John Swofford said it could come within six months. Bowlsby said an NCAA special convention may be needed.

A special convention in 1985 established the death penalty for chronic NCAA violators. The next special convention may mean football death -- at least at the top level of the game -- for every hyphenated, directional school below the BCS Mendoza Line.

Get ready, then, for Division 4, where those BCS schools (Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-12, ACC, SEC) are going to set their own rules."

[Lobot]

I saw a LOT of twitter chatter concerning Swofford (ACC) and Bowlsby's (Big12) remarks during their respective conference Media days. The Div. 4 idea has been floated IF the NCAA doesn't shape up. Both Swofford and Bowlsby indicated that they do not wish to to leave the NCAA but changes need to be made. Now Div. 4 could be one of those changes I suppose.

The consensus among a lot of the P5/P4 commisioners is that it's way too easy to get into FBS. The football writers were taking votes yesterday on which schools did not really belong in FBS even inside the Power conferences. Names like Northwestern, Wake, Duke and others surfaced.

It's going to interesting to see what everyone ends up doing. If we do get a power 4 in Div 4 will those conferences shake up their own membership and effectively strengthen some existing FBS leagues like the American?

[blackattack]

It's going to interesting to see what everyone ends up doing. If we do get a power 4 in Div 4 will those conferences shake up their own membership and effectively strengthen some existing FBS leagues like the American?

Hadn't thought of the possibility that a shakeup could ultimately strengthen some of the existing FBS leagues. But I think you're right. It's hard to picture programs like Wake Forest, Duke, Iowa State, IU, etc hanging with the real power programs in their respective conferences.

[jbreeds1]

Anyone have a suspicion on what this would mean for us? Possible expansions by the power conferences or just more teams left out in the dark?

[Lobot]

It strikes me as more teams left out. In retro IU and UK and Vandy were also mentioned.

[bearcattom]

My guess....it's as simple as if you add something to the pie...you're in. If not, well you're out.

(TV $)

Could you imagine if UC were left out of the top division? After spending $86M, I should hope not.

I have read many articles stating the voting procedure where very small schools w limited budgets are blocking the $2000 stipend..,that this is and the overall "everybody gets a vote no matter your $" is the core driver for a split.

I would think UC w a budget over $50M would make the cut.

[bearcattom]

The American likely to push for NCAA subdivision inclusion

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoot...sion-inclusion

[Lobot]

Aresco has already come out and tried to put his foot in the door to the P5. sportswriters are laughing at him. Looks bad.

[bearcattom]

Aresco has already come out and tried to put his foot in the door to the P5. sportswriters are laughing at him. Looks bad.

It certainly does look bad.

The reality is UC has more cachet on its own than w/ the American collective.

[Rational Cat]

Great article. The further and further away these football factories get away from the concept of "student-athlete" (and I use that term loosely) the less I like it.

They're talking now about paying players, above the table. I'm not sure our cash strapped Bearcats can afford that.

I don't like where this is headed, and I'm not even sure I want UC to be a part of it. ACC? Absolutely. Big 12? No way, we have nothing in common with any of those schools, except barely with WVU. And I recently heard Oliver Luck say that his current challenge is to convince his rabid fan base that 7 wins is a successful season.

Division 4 will essentially be minor league league football for the NFL.

I have a newfound respect for the NFL and pro sports- at least their greed is in full view, above the table. It's all about the money, and they admit that.

The college football powerhouses on the other hand still publicly contend that it's about tradition, student athletes, etc, etc, etc. BS- it's all about the money. I have found myself really turned off by college football as of late, sorry to be such a downer. Go Cats!

[Brian H.]

Great article. The further and further away these football factories get away from the concept of "student-athlete" (and I use that term loosely) the less I like it.

They're talking now about paying players, above the table. I'm not sure our cash strapped Bearcats can afford that.

I don't like where this is headed, and I'm not even sure I want UC to be a part of it. ACC? Absolutely. Big 12? No way, we have nothing in common with any of those schools, except barely with WVU. And I recently heard Oliver Luck say that his current challenge is to convince his rabid fan base that 7 wins is a successful season.

Division 4 will essentially be minor league league football for the NFL.

I have a newfound respect for the NFL and pro sports- at least their greed is in full view, above the table. It's all about the money, and they admit that.

The college football powerhouses on the other hand still publicly contend that it's about tradition, student athletes, etc, etc, etc. BS- it's all about the money. I have found myself really turned off by college football as of late, sorry to be such a downer. Go Cats!

I agree with you. Let the 40 or whatever Minor League NFL teams go, they can have the cheating, the steroids, the criminals. I am fine with being in the tier of schools like Duke, NC, Wake, Kansas, UK, etc. We can play good competitive football and compete with the top of that tier every year.

[blackattack]

I agree with you. Let the 40 or whatever Minor League NFL teams go, they can have the cheating, the steroids, the criminals. I am fine with being in the tier of schools like Duke, NC, Wake, Kansas, UK, etc. We can play good competitive football and compete with the top of that tier every year.

Yep, put me in the same camp. Guess I could be wrong, but if I'm an engaged parent of a Major college prospect, do I really want my kid going to one of these big football factories (with a bunch of kids like Maurice Clarett and Aaron Hernandez)??? If you think major college sports are ethically challenged now, wait till these kids are being paid a nice "stipend". By the way, once they start paying the players, it won't stop with a "stipend". The players will probably organize and want progressively more benefits and money all the time. It's going to be a mess, and I'm not sure I want my alma mater being in the middle of it.

[swilsonsp4]

Unfortunately, there will be ramifications in all other sports. Stipends are not going to be limited to football. That will decimate the top tier of basketball players, for instance, from the likelihood that they will enroll at UC, Gonzaga, Butler, Memphis, etc., unless those schools also give in and offer similar stipends. And, unless the so-called D4 conferences bolt from the NCAA, then those schools will be far less likely to be competitive in the Big Dance. If they do bolt, then the Dance will be the equivalent of a Junior High Sock Hop.

[Rock]

I Disagree

I disagree with the "roll over and play dead" attitude. I am extremely disappointed that UC is on the out looking in. We are taking steps to make us a more viable option thanks to Whit. Today, as I listened to the AD from WVU, I was even more disappointed. He said any conference realignment is probably another 3 years out or more!-- That they are extremely fortunate to be in the Big 12. About paying players---the extra money UC would receive from being in a power conference would more than offset any cost.
I don't have any answer for it, but we need to somehow get our behind into the mix!! You don't quit!

[Rational Cat]

I disagree with the "roll over and play dead" attitude. I am extremely disappointed that UC is on the out looking in. We are taking steps to make us a more viable option thanks to Whit. Today, as I listened to the AD from WVU, I was even more disappointed. He said any conference realignment is probably another 3 years out or more!-- That they are extremely fortunate to be in the Big 12. About paying players---the extra money UC would receive from being in a power conference would more than offset any cost.
I don't have any answer for it, but we need to somehow get our behind into the mix!! You don't quit!

I'm very interested in UC continuing to be a major participant in amateur collegiate sports.

I have no interest in UC participating or trying to compete in professional or quasi-professional sports.

It's not about "quitting" it's about what it is that we want to participate in. The landscape is rapidly changing along with the ground rules, and I, for one, am giving serious consideration as to whether I want to continue to participate and contribute.

This is a site for just such debate; I'll not go along just to get along any longer. The amounts of money spent on amateur athletics (especially football) is completely absurd, and in order to belong to the club, UC and the rest of us supporters and UCATS members are going to have to continue to pony up more and more. There is a limit to what I will be willing to give; I don't know what that limit is for me yet, but it is quickly approaching.

Roll over and play dead? Maybe it's more like wake up and smell the coffee.

This is nothing against UC at all. All we have done as a university in major sports for the last 10 years is give and give as donors, and our teams have consistently finished in the top 20-40 every year in football and basketball. And yet, we're still on the outside, watching others have dinner through the window. 2nd class citizens. There literally is nothing else we can do. Yes, go to the games, give more money, yada yada. To what end?

Bearcat Chris caught much grief here in the last few years advocating a return to the MAC. I'm not so sure now that he is wrong.

UC will NEVER be in any position of advantage as long as the governor of this state, the senate and the house all bend over backwards for OSU, and do nothing for the rest of the schools and team in the state.