Wes Miller thread Take 2

[Lobot]

Justin WIlliiams wrote about Wes Miller and his methods yesterday: ($)

https://theathletic.com/3094932/2022...ar-head-coach/

[GoBearcats31]

Today is Wes Miller's 39th birthday. 365 more days until we can longer list him among top coaches under 40. (Which reminds me of when Jeff Borzello or someone put together such a list for ESPN last year and had Travis Steele #2).... anyways, happy birthday Coach! Hasn't been a perfect year, but I'd like to think UC basketball is on the right track.

[GoBearcats31]

1/27 radio show
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/71-uc...are&embed=true

[Lobot]

Justin WIlliiams wrote about Wes Miller and his methods yesterday: ($)

https://theathletic.com/3094932/2022...ar-head-coach/

One of the big takewaways from this article for those who weren't able to read it, is that Mike Roberts is the one calling the substitution patterns with Wes vetoing chnages if he needs to. If you don't like the sub patterns it's not entirely Wes' fault.

[Gmann]

One of the big takewaways from this article for those who weren't able to read it, is that Mike Roberts is the one calling the substitution patterns with Wes vetoing chnages if he needs to. If you don't like the sub patterns it's not entirely Wes' fault.

Good to know. Wes also indicated on his radio show that Roberts primarily is the one working with the bigs on finishing at the basket. So at this point I have two reasons to be less than satisfied with his contribution. We'll see how it goes from here but I don't like the trend so far.

[Oldtimer_UC_fan]

Good to know. Wes also indicated on his radio show that Roberts primarily is the one working with the bigs on finishing at the basket. So at this point I have two reasons to be less than satisfied with his contribution. We'll see how it goes from here but I don't like the trend so far.

Finishing? When? They are non existent offensively.

[GoBearcats31]

Wes Miller, who won his 200th career game yesterday, rocking the Joe Burrow jersey this morning: https://twitter.com/GoBearcatsMBB/st...54548594225154

[GoBearcats31]

ESPN's Jeff Borzello did a feature on Walker Miller (Monmouth), with plenty in there about older little brother Wes (including, of course, the Monmouth-UC game). One such excerpt:

Miller acknowledges that a career with 36 points and 31 rebounds in 140 minutes didn't provide much tape for coaches to scout his game.

But he did have his brother: So what about Cincinnati, where Wes had just been hired to replace John Brannen?

This time, the brothers actually discussed the possibility -- if only briefly.

"At the end of the day, I think it's a really hard situation for us both," Walker said. "When there's a relative on the team, I think it can work well when [it's] the best player on the team. Like [Doug] McDermott at Creighton, it's easy. Nobody questions it when he's that good. Or your son has to be the worst player on the team and never play. Anywhere in between, it's a lot of pressure on the coach."

Wes was on the same page.

"When I took the Cincinnati job, it was talked about. I just didn't think it would have been fair to him," Wes said. "For him to play for his brother would put a spotlight on him, the guys in the locker room, the fan base -- that would be a little bit unfair. If he's playing well or if he's not playing well but still playing minutes, people might see favoritism. ... He didn't play at UNC for four years."

ttps://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/33151816/how-four-year-unc-basketball-walk-walker-miller-became-star-monmouth-why-never-played-famous-older-brother

[RedDog]

Yesterday at a high level high school playoff game, I had the opportunity to visit at length with a local AD friend who is VERY well connected in Chapel Hill. I asked him about Wes. To my surprise he responded that the majority of the committee hiring votes last year at NC were in support of selecting Wes, but that the underlying agreement in Roy's contract were that he got to select his replacement unless he waived that right, which he didn't. Roy made the call, the committee's recommendation was over ridden. Time will tell at both ends who got the best of that deal but my point is blue blood NC wanted the guy we got, so we owe it to him to give him the time to develop and implement his own system and guys. FYI, for those of us who followed Roy's career fairly closely, Wes looks like a carbon copy on and off the court. The same things we are complaining about Roy has been accused of for years. His record stands for itself and the only difference is the caliber of player he had at his dispose. Just saying......

[Gmann]

Yesterday at a high level high school playoff game, I had the opportunity to visit at length with a local AD friend who is VERY well connected in Chapel Hill. I asked him about Wes. To my surprise he responded that the majority of the committee hiring votes last year at NC were in support of selecting Wes, but that the underlying agreement in Roy's contract were that he got to select his replacement unless he waived that right, which he didn't. Roy made the call, the committee's recommendation was over ridden. Time will tell at both ends who got the best of that deal but my point is blue blood NC wanted the guy we got, so we owe it to him to give him the time to develop and implement his own system and guys. FYI, for those of us who followed Roy's career fairly closely, Wes looks like a carbon copy on and off the court. The same things we are complaining about Roy has been accused of for years. His record stands for itself and the only difference is the caliber of player he had at his dispose. Just saying......

I think the last line is the key to whole thing. If Wes can't get the blue chip players like Roy did (because of the elite Tar Heel program) I don't see much success since development seems not to be a strength. After the season ends in a few short weeks we should start to see whether there will be apprecialble upgrades to the roster and more communication on just what will improve things going forward.

[BorisTheCat]

One thing I did hear CWM mention surprised/disappointed me. He pretty much said that their sub rotations and playing time are pretty much set. Players know when they will be subbing in and how many minutes that will likely get. He says that he likes his players to have that predictability. While I get that, that approach seems to result in what we see with Madsen.... hits 3/4 and then sits. Seems to me you can have a general idea but if Madsen is hitting, why would you pull him for say MAW who is a fairly poor shooter. Now all of that being said, if that has always been his approach and it obviously has been succesful... he knows way better than me. I just dont like the idea of minutes almost being guaranteed... that's the coach's best leverage.

[Gmann]

One thing I did hear CWM mention surprised/disappointed me. He pretty much said that their sub rotations and playing time are pretty much set. Players know when they will be subbing in and how many minutes that will likely get. He says that he likes his players to have that predictability. While I get that, that approach seems to result in what we see with Madsen.... hits 3/4 and then sits. Seems to me you can have a general idea but if Madsen is hitting, why would you pull him for say MAW who is a fairly poor shooter. Now all of that being said, if that has always been his approach and it obviously has been succesful... he knows way better than me. I just like the idea of minutes almost being guaranteed... that's the coach's best leverage.

Really no incentive to play harder or better if minutes are pretty much pre-determined. There's no carrot or stick in that approach and could certainly lead to the decline we've seen.

[Carin's Dad]

One thing I did hear CWM mention surprised/disappointed me. He pretty much said that their sub rotations and playing time are pretty much set. Players know when they will be subbing in and how many minutes that will likely get. He says that he likes his players to have that predictability. While I get that, that approach seems to result in what we see with Madsen.... hits 3/4 and then sits. Seems to me you can have a general idea but if Madsen is hitting, why would you pull him for say MAW who is a fairly poor shooter. Now all of that being said, if that has always been his approach and it obviously has been succesful... he knows way better than me. I just like the idea of minutes almost being guaranteed... that's the coach's best leverage.

Reminds me of the one game I coached my daughter's co-ed team. They got upset when I kept the best player on the floor instead of making every kid get equal floor time. But that was 5th or 6th grade.

[BorisTheCat]

Playing time is EVERYTHING to players... it's the best way to reward those following the coach's plans. Again, I yield to what CWM has found works best for him but... seems weird to me.

[richard k.]

Playing time is EVERYTHING to players... it's the best way to reward those following the coach's plans. Again, I yield to what CWM has found works best for him but... seems weird to me.

While the timing of the substitution patterns may be suspect Miller has said he believes allowing excessive court time over the season wears out your best players so that they are too tired to be at their best towards the end of the season. Argue that if you want (especially the way this team currently looks) but if you look at the average game court time it certainly looks as if the players most of us think should be on the court have the most playing time. And while some may think they aren't on the court enough, unless coach changes his philosophy this is what we'll continue to see.