UCF April 3 at 7:00 PM on FS1

[BearKatz]

To reinforce this, BYU's boosters are paying Dybantsa a reported $8M for his upcoming one year of service. Per Chad Brendel, UC's entire basketball NIL is $6-7M.

Yeah, must be nice to have $8M laying around.

[sedz]

The fact is, nobody's complaining! Iv'e heard numerous times throughout the season, Rayvon's not playing because he's a defensive LIABILTY!

So are we throwing out defense for 5 Star Recruits and not others? Becuase Rayvon Grffith was never known for his defense in HS! He was known for his scoring ability! Thats my Point!

I don't remember hearing that. I think Rayvon doesn't play because he fouls too much. He's seen the court more in March, and in those games he committed 7 fouls in 33 minutes. That's too much to tolerate, especially for a non post player.

[BearKatz]

I don't remember hearing that. I think Rayvon doesn't play because he fouls too much. He's seen the court more in March, and in those games he committed 7 fouls in 33 minutes. That's too much to tolerate, especially for a non post player.

Yeah he does foul a lot! But ok, you don't remember ever saying he can't play defense! Must be another member I'm thinking of!

[GoBearcats31]

I don't remember hearing that. I think Rayvon doesn't play because he fouls too much. He's seen the court more in March, and in those games he committed 7 fouls in 33 minutes. That's too much to tolerate, especially for a non post player.

Griffith had 18 fouls in 107 minutes

Compare that with:
Hickman 13 fouls in 255 minutes
Betsey 26 fouls in 379 minutes
Lukosius 29 fouls in 875 minutes

Also Griffith played a good chunk of minutes in late game garbage times where the games were decided and, thus, less physical.

3 fouls in 4 minutes twice (Grambling, Oklahoma State)

[sedz]

Griffith had 18 fouls in 107 minutes

Compare that with:
Hickman 13 fouls in 255 minutes
Betsey 26 fouls in 379 minutes
Lukosius 29 fouls in 875 minutes

Also Griffith played a good chunk of minutes in late game garbage times where the games were decided and, thus, less physical.

3 fouls in 4 minutes twice (Grambling, Oklahoma State)

And that's not unusual for a first year player, but it's one of the reasons freshman typically don't come in and start right away. The other is turnovers, but Rayvon has been very good at taking care of the ball this year - his 8% TO rate tied with Reed for best on the team.

I'm all about athletic wings who can shoot, rebound, and defend multiple positions. Rayvon fits that mold so I hope he stays and earns a rotation spot.

[BorisTheCat]

Fouls per minute is also not a valid "how good of defensive player are you".... If it were you would be indicating that Lukosius is a GREAT defender... ummmm... no

[Rufus]

When you have point guard that don't pass, won't defend, wont rebound, won't try to steal the ball, refuses to pass unless forced to, and then have two wings in your rotation that hardly move to get a pass, and are happy to sit and wait for a pass that never comes, and when you put PG at shooting guard but can't do anything but take desperation shots is not going to win many games. I can't see anyone paying him the kind of money we are to transfer so what's a coach to do. If Tillery or Abeav can do anything at all relative to the position they were recruited for on a consistent basis, for however minutes they each get a game would be more than what we got the majority of games this year. We have too too many players that are one dimensional and relish on that one dimension .

[zykarious]

And that's not unusual for a first year player, but it's one of the reasons freshman typically don't come in and start right away. The other is turnovers, but Rayvon has been very good at taking care of the ball this year - his 8% TO rate tied with Reed for best on the team.

I'm all about athletic wings who can shoot, rebound, and defend multiple positions. Rayvon fits that mold so I hope he stays and earns a rotation spot.

I think there's a lot to like about Rayvon, yes he fouls too much and his defense was suspect at times early in the season. But he rebounds very well for his size, consistently brings energy and his defense improved throughout the season. Plus he's shown an ability to handle the ball, back down his defender and score with a short jumper that no one else on the team has shown, plus he seems to actually draw fouls.

The problem is I don't think he handles the ball well enough to play the 2, which puts him in direct competition with Reed for backup minutes if they both return. Is he up for that? We know Reed is a hard worker and excellent defender, if Reed can improve his three point shot over the summer (should be the main focus area of him and Jizzle) he can be a quality 3-and-D guy and hard to steal minutes from. Griffith is smaller, but has more athleticism, is a better rebounder (especially on the offensive end) and more overall offensive ability, so I could see him beating Reed out, but it would definitely be easier to get guaranteed minutes elsewhere.

[leeraymond]

We have brought in many scorers who could not defend at first. Sean Kilpatrick and Steve Logan to name a couple.

If you want guys who excel at offense and defense when they step foot on campus, call up Cincy Reigns and tell 'em you're ready to sign an 8 figure check.

Kilpatrick, Caupain, and Cumberland were not good defenders (I do not remember Logan's defensive capabilities). They never were. Cronin understood that. That is why he developed defensive systems that relied more on switching principles rather than have his guards attempt to run through picks and screens. Miller does not understand that. However, all of the guys I just mentioned were not one-dimensional players. In my mind, that is the big difference in how old UC coaches recruited compared to how Miller recruits. Even you have complained about all of the one-dimensional players that Miller has brought in. From what I have seen of Abaev, he may be more of the same.

I was watching the McDonalds game, and I begin to wonder who K. Sampson recruited. I am NOT lying when I tell you before I even knew who the Houston recruit was, I was able to pick him out by understanding how Houston plays and what Sampson might be looking for in a player. Hartswell, or something like, was the Houston recruit. The way that he moved, his energy, and his continuous motion made me say to myself, that is a Houston recruit. And sure enough, he was. Abaev was totally different in his presence and movement. That is the difference between a winning coach and a losing coach: recruits.

To me, it is a good thing when a freshman, no matter if he is a pro-prospect, cannot come in and take a veteran's position. That shows that a punk freshman coming from high school is no match for college men. Sometimes a freshman can come in and take somebody's spot. Since I have been watching UC basketball, that does not happen often. I do not think that Abaev is going to move anybody out; but maybe he can.

Even in Miller's old fashion, out of date, and ineffective defense, a guy probably will not see the floor unless he can play a little defense. The only problem is Miller's defensive system is no good.

[leeraymond]

In all fairness -- Logan and Kilpatrick had coaches who understood defense - both its value and how to teach it -- they also expected the players to play it - of course they didn't expect one to play what they had not been taught or had the heart for. Concerning your reply to Lee. He just stated his opinion as a lover of the Cats; as did you. All views should be considered with grace. I know last year I got all kinds of slack for going against JJ in here. This is a place not just to give stats, but to vent and hopefully one day celebrate. I don't think Lee was being personal. He was being a fan. Everyone's voice adds to our community.

Hey Leo, I appreciate the shout-out. I did not take Sedz's comments personally. He is a concerned UC Bearcat fan like we all are. He wants the team to win. Look, we are all a little upset by how the season played itself out. We expected so much more out of this team. This team was a top 20 national team; 10-1 in the non-conference and became a doormat team in the BIG XII. UC ended up in 13th place out of 16 teams. UC lost 5 of its last 7 games. That really is hard to take.

There are spill-over emotions impacting our views of the recruiting. Abaev is the target of focus right now. He is going to be scrutinized. That is natural coming from the fans and stakeholders. I truly hope that Abaev can come in and make plays. God knows that UC needs all the help that it can get. For Miller's sake, let's hope that he made the right choice in recruits. Stay tuned.

[bearcatbret]

And to think that Freshmen will contribute, Kilpatrick redshirted his freshman year. Of course, that was partly due to "Born Ready" on the team.

[swilsonsp4]

Kilpatrick, Caupain, and Cumberland were not good defenders (I do not remember Logan's defensive capabilities). They never were. Cronin understood that. That is why he developed defensive systems that relied more on switching principles rather than have his guards attempt to run through picks and screens. Miller does not understand that. However, all of the guys I just mentioned were not one-dimensional players. In my mind, that is the big difference in how old UC coaches recruited compared to how Miller recruits. Even you have complained about all of the one-dimensional players that Miller has brought in. From what I have seen of Abaev, he may be more of the same.

I was watching the McDonalds game, and I begin to wonder who K. Sampson recruited. I am NOT lying when I tell you before I even knew who the Houston recruit was, I was able to pick him out by understanding how Houston plays and what Sampson might be looking for in a player. Hartswell, or something like, was the Houston recruit. The way that he moved, his energy, and his continuous motion made me say to myself, that is a Houston recruit. And sure enough, he was. Abaev was totally different in his presence and movement. That is the difference between a winning coach and a losing coach: recruits.

To me, it is a good thing when a freshman, no matter if he is a pro-prospect, cannot come in and take a veteran's position. That shows that a punk freshman coming from high school is no match for college men. Sometimes a freshman can come in and take somebody's spot. Since I have been watching UC basketball, that does not happen often. I do not think that Abaev is going to move anybody out; but maybe he can.

Even in Miller's old fashion, out of date, and ineffective defense, a guy probably will not see the floor unless he can play a little defense. The only problem is Miller's defensive system is no good.

The Bearcats' defense wasn't the problem. Even after Darius Johnson carved them up last night, UC's defensive efficiency is #22 in KenPom and #19 in BartTorvik. That puts them at #5 in the B12, which is darned good.

[BearKatz]

This is a place not just to give stats, but to vent and hopefully one day celebrate.

Couldn't have said it better Leo! Stats NEVER tell the whole story, regardless of what some think!

Example: Rayvon fouls too much in the short time he plays. I could argue who did he foul, how many foul shots were made? Was the game already decided? Etc etc etc....

Would you take 10pts from Rayvon in 16mins and fouling out? Or would you prefer some games Lukosius playing 20mins, and chipping in 6pts?

What's more valuable when your losing a game?

UC has had many players in the past, where the lights don't turn on till their Junior Season! How fair is it to judge every player on stats?

I'm curious, what was Kenyon Martin's Positive / Negative BPM after his first season with UC? Should we have given up on him after one year?

[London 'Cat]

This is a place not just to give stats, but to vent and hopefully one day celebrate.

Couldn't have said it better Leo! Stats NEVER tell the whole story, regardless of what some think!

Example: Rayvon fouls too much in the short time he plays. I could argue who did he foul, how many foul shots were made? Was the game already decided? Etc etc etc....

Would you take 10pts from Rayvon in 16mins and fouling out? Or would you prefer some games Lukosius playing 20mins, and chipping in 6pts?

What's more valuable when your losing a game?

UC has had many players in the past, where the lights don't turn on till their Junior Season! How fair is it to judge every player on stats?

I'm curious, what was Kenyon Martin's Positive / Negative BPM after his first season with UC? Should we have given up on him after one year?

Counter points. The college game has changed immensely since Martin was a freshman. Much easier to transfer with the portal. Players can now be paid directly and through NIL. If a player has not received his perceived playing time he can easily transfer to another school. The metrics of a player are often the most useful measure of a player’s value to a team and program overall. There is never a guarantee that a player will be on a roster beyond the current season, much less a third season.

[sedz]

This is a place not just to give stats, but to vent and hopefully one day celebrate.

Couldn't have said it better Leo! Stats NEVER tell the whole story, regardless of what some think!

Example: Rayvon fouls too much in the short time he plays. I could argue who did he foul, how many foul shots were made? Was the game already decided? Etc etc etc....

Would you take 10pts from Rayvon in 16mins and fouling out? Or would you prefer some games Lukosius playing 20mins, and chipping in 6pts?

What's more valuable when your losing a game?

UC has had many players in the past, where the lights don't turn on till their Junior Season! How fair is it to judge every player on stats?

I'm curious, what was Kenyon Martin's Positive / Negative BPM after his first season with UC? Should we have given up on him after one year?

Lots of strawmen here. I have never claimed that stats tell the whole story, that I prefer Simas over Rayvon, or that I would give up on a player based on freshman stats. Often times I simply present advanced statistics because they are part of the story. Everyone can come to their own conclusions based on them.

We don't know Kenyon's BPM because college basketball didn't fully track substitutions until 2008. But we can look at some advanced statistics. Kenyon committed 8.8 fouls per 40 minutes and had a 22.5% turnover rate, which as I said earlier are the two areas most freshmen struggle. That's why he only played 233 minutes over the 34 game season, an average of under 7 mpg. But he showed promise by making 65% effective field goals as a freshman with 13 rebounds, 4 blocks, and 2 steals per 40 minutes. Those per minute numbers stayed almost exactly the same throughout his career. He clearly had upside, but just needed to cut down on fouls and turnovers to get more playing time.

And that's all I said about Rayvon. He needs to foul less. I don't think that's controversial.